Chimera Kennels

I have not been online been so busy as we moved a month ago and also have gotten some new dogs so the internet has been the last place I have been found lately.

I however am looking for advise on this new dogo I purchased. I think the dog is seriously messed up.

He has been through a few homes, is just 2 years old as of july 09. He is intact never been bred always been a house dog. Very dog agressive you know how the story goes.

3 days ago his clipped popped off his chain and he was found posturing to my 8 1/2 year old male male. Now my old guy is very tolerant and was just sniffing wagging his tail as he wont fight until the other dog bites first.

By the time we walked over calmly yet quickly the dogo jumped him, they both had a chunk of each others face however my corso tore the dogo up real bad but the dogo would not let go and I did everything from pickin him up by his nuts and holding him in the air, to holding both hind legs up while we opened his mouth to release the grip.

All in all maybe 5 mins and they were apart.

Now the dogos begins to growl at us while we are cleaning his wounds. But when he growls he shakes.

I approach this dog and he gets all happy jumpin wagging and the moment I touch him he freezes and growls. Yet he will not look at me while he growls he looks away and trembles.

He wont stop growling now at everyone and everything.

The past owner said he will growl if you make him do things he dont like. I assumed just dominant,

But then he arrived and seemed like he loves to please and is very imature and puppyish. However he also seemed like he has had a serious thumping or more by humans as he was acting unsure and would not make eye contact and would drop his head when ever I came near him.

Now since the fight he is worse.

I have no problem fixing this dog IF he is fixable, I feel bad for him and am disapointed that he is this way .

Any feed back I am greatful for, I have seen and worked through close to a hundred so called rejects waiting for euthanization over the years but this is the first I have seen like him.

When I am stuck is the fact that I dont want to disapline for growling as he becomes worse as he trembles harder and continues to growl yet I wont walk away from a growling dog in my home. So I am sticking around until he stops then I leave but think its making things worse.

I offering him his food and when I begin to walk away he begins to growl so I go back say nothing and remove the food and leave it until he stops.

This is about as far as I have gone with him so far.

Should I continue working with him or just send him back?

Thanks

1. If the dog turned on you, could you handle him? Honestly, he sounds like he may be more than you can handle if it was to hit the fan. Also, who knows how deep these issues are...you may have a dog with issues that may be deeper than you think given the fact that his previous owner admitted the dog would growl at his owner...regardless of if the root is genetic or environmental.

2. For this dog, if you insist on "giving him a try" I would use the Caesar Milan method of calm assertiveness combined with nonstressful exercise...like a walk that patiently turned into a jog...to get the dog's mind off the "concerns" until the dog is more relaxed.  Then, I would feed him in a manner that he earns every bit...not by doing ob, but by simply being nice and gentle...to reward calmness and a subservent demenor. Once that is done, I would then move into ob work...but easy stufff until the bond is strengthened.

3. Finally, if the growling goes uncorrected, I would not be surprised if the growling doesn't get worse as it could be self-rewarding if unchecked...however, I can not advise you to check the dog because the dog might check you when you go to check him and I can't be responsible for your injuries should he be more than you can handle.

All this said, I personally don't have time for dogs I can't trust.

Tuff spot when you truelly want to help a dog. I have rescued a few but if I cant trust it , its not coming in my house. As far as the rage it could be genetic as Lee mentioned. I read about a bandog breeder using Neo Mast. as a major part of his program and explained how early on alot of his specimens had serious rage issues that were genetic through bad breading. That is a major factor that the best training isn't going to solve. Another factor is the fight he was in with your other dog and getting messed up, just being in the room is a reminder and trigger and knowing the other dog is around and the dogo is technically still the stranger in the house.

Check this guy out he has a program I've been following, he specializes in worst case dogs that other trainers say cant be helped.

http://www.k-91.com/

http://www.selfhelpdogtraining.com/

Thanks.

I have not yet decided what my plan is for this dogo, he is now in a kennel away from our home and dogs. You can go down and take him out go for a nice walk and he is calm and walks VERY nicely at your side. Tail in a relaxed position but once you touch him even when walkin his tail goes down and he begins a low growl.

Lee I personally dont think I at 5ft 2 and maybe 130lbs can out fight a 2yr old 130pound maybe 135lbs 30-31inch tall dogo alone. I have had thousands of dogs go threw my home many were biters and never can say I did not trust one like this guy.

Most I had figured out fast but this dog gives very confusing messages. He will get happy and wagging his tail, play bowing and being all silly then when close enough begin his low growl crap.

Would you say at this point dont touch or do anything to trigger the growling? And just work on building trust.

I wont work the dog alone and have been getting my husband to work with him as he has zero fear of the dog and can handle him, I am not comfortable with the dog at this point as I have not figured him out completly in my head yet.

Thanks

If you have doubts for your safety or anyone else's safety, then honestly, I would put the dog down.

Lee I would like to have this dog put down as he is very unstable and really cares less about people period. Not to mention very large and powerful. I however have a contract with the seller and she states she is coming to buy him back.

If she does not soon then I will be putting him down. I have not touched the dog since as I dont trust him. He is penned up solidly as I dont wish to have any other dogs tore up.

Thanks for the advise:)

You might want to consider asking the breeder to sign an acknowledgement of the dog's aggressive tendencies, so should a problem arrise with the dog later on they can't come back and blame you for the issues.

I recently read on one of the message boards that Jon at Fala Woods was looking for dogs for his students.  He was welcoming dogs with issues.  Never met Jon personally but we've talked alot on the phone and he stepped up to help me out on a dog deal gone bad.  Fortunately, we didnt need him.  But I'd say he's a good guy and well known for rehabing 'bad" dogs.

Although my experience with Dogo's is limited, everything I've seen has not been good. They're certainly not a breed for everyone!

Good luck with your tough decision - and in the meantime STAY SAFE.

Leri

Angela, If you are talking about the Argentine Dogo I have had  a lot of experience with them (relatively speaking of course)  and experience with

male Dogo's that were given up as adults.  

My one short stab at breeding was with the A. Dogo and the two I had in my Guard dog company, that were given up, were truly bad boys to cross, some of the baddest I have seen.  I had no choice when i got them but to make them work.  They were both sort of screwy like your dog.  I truly think they are more handler sensitive and devoted than most people can understand.  I found their aggession when I first got them to stem from confusion more than anger or meaness. 

Not sure if you are talking about the Argentine Dogo or not but I wont waste space here writing if I don't know what you are speakng of.  If I can be of any help feel free to call and discuss 817-483-2026 My hats off to you for trying to help this guy either way it turns out.    

Lee thanks, I did plan to make them sign something that I was no longer responsible for the dogs actions or anything once it leaves here.

Its rather confusing as the past owners now want the dog then dont. They say they can pay back what I paid as they told me he was stable with only dog aggression issues \. Thats not the case and talking with a past buyer who also returned him I have come to believe the owners are the dogs biggest problem.

I think what has happened here is people have bullied the dog when they thought the dog was being dominant and created the behavior. This dog makes no eye contact even when he first arrived and when you verbally correct him he stops what he is doing right away. However if you are to harsh he begins to growl and shiver and he wont stop growling until you back away.

I dont back away but instead stay close but in a safe spot and do other things until he settles and stops growling then I walk away. The dog thinks people are threats. He has never trusted from the info I have on him. I like to think no dog is bad most times it idiots that ruin them.

I have now moved him to a escape proof chain inside of a pen and am offering him small amounts of food tossed in, I am doing the no talk, no touch no eye contact thing and he has no growled as of yet. Its only been a day or so, I am trying not to push my luck and a, thinking maybe if I treat him like he is wild instead of  a dog with an attitude.

I am not sure what gonna happen. I really dont have the heart to put him down. I trust I can work him threw this and create balance and make him a fairly good pet but I am not sure I want to commit to him as I would rather give that time to my prospects and other dogs.

I really am thankful for everyones input. I now have my new computer so I can upload pics and videos and would like to get some and maybe share them here with you all of this dogo and see if I am on the right page.

Thanks

Angela,

Have you tried the "spit the hot dog out when he looks at you" method to teach the "watch" or "look?" Calm reward combined with eye contact can be used to build trust.

Honestly, again though...if the dog is shivering and growling, I wouldn't personally deal with it...but if you want to have a "rescue" program then 1. calm reward and exercise to build trust and 2. calm assertiveness to establish who's the boss does work.

You can use the spit the hotdog method to teach the dog that looking at you is a good thing IF you let the dog get hungry.

Some times these decisions can be hard, but until you decide...just be safe. You don't want to have regrets later thinking..."I knew I should have put him down before he..."

ya I hear ya...I do wish I just did not buy him in the first place as I hate making these choices. Thanks again.

Hi guys, just an update the dogo is leaving going back to his past owners in 3 days, she is gonna sign an agreement that I am no longer responsible for him or his actions.

Thanks again for the help you provided.