Chimera Kennels

I was wondering when working a dog why do people encourage the dog to keep the sleeve in its mouth? I understand if you are working a dog in prey, but when it comes to working them in defense i notice dogs are allowed to shake the sleeve up, I find this counter productive as i want a dog that immediately drops the sleeve and puts the attention right back on the decoy once the sleeve is dropped! is there a reason for this? i am curious to see what some of your guys opinions are on this....

It depends on the trainer.

Some trainers do it because they have no idea why...they see others do it, so they do it.

Some do it because they hear about it being a reward, so they reward the dog. This can be a valid reason depending upon the dog, but not every dog needs this reward. Some do, some don't.

Some do it because they are trying to produce a BALANCED dog. This is the right reason to use the slip. The best PP dog is one that displays balance. You want enough defense to maintain a degree of sharpness...but you also want enough prey to maintain high confidence. To decide if you need to do a slip/carry you need to be able to read the dog and see what drive the dog is working in and what drive needs to be developed. If the dog needs more defense, there is little or no need to do a slip. If the dog needs more prey work, then doing a carry can help in that avenue. If the dog needs confidence (a win) this too can help as it relates to both balancing defense with confidence by using prey work.

In the end, you would have to ask each trainer why they do it. Some have good reasons for it, some don't.

In some cases it is productive, in some cases it is counter productive.

A good trainer doens't work a routine, instead they work the dog and develop a plan to work on what the dog needs by evaluating (reading) what the dog displays. A good trainer will USE the dog's strengths to tap into drive and then transfer the work into areas that cause the now motivated dog to develop the dog's weaknesses...and then go back and forth between these areas so one ends up with a final product that is balanced (without weaknesses).

chimerakennels at August 10, 2011 at 5:27 PM

It depends on the trainer.

Some trainers do it because they have no idea why...they see others do it, so they do it.

Some do it because they hear about it being a reward, so they reward the dog. This can be a valid reason depending upon the dog, but not every dog needs this reward. Some do, some don't.

Some do it because they are trying to produce a BALANCED dog. This is the right reason to use the slip. The best PP dog is one that displays balance. You want enough defense to maintain a degree of sharpness...but you also want enough prey to maintain high confidence. To decide if you need to do a slip/carry you need to be able to read the dog and see what drive the dog is working in and what drive needs to be developed. If the dog needs more defense, there is little or no need to do a slip. If the dog needs more prey work, then doing a carry can help in that avenue. If the dog needs confidence (a win) this too can help as it relates to both balancing defense with confidence by using prey work.

In the end, you would have to ask each trainer why they do it. Some have good reasons for it, some don't.

In some cases it is productive, in some cases it is counter productive.

A good trainer doens't work a routine, instead they work the dog and develop a plan to work on what the dog needs by evaluating (reading) what the dog displays. A good trainer will USE the dog's strengths to tap into drive and then transfer the work into areas that cause the now motivated dog to develop the dog's weaknesses...and then go back and forth between these areas so one ends up with a final product that is balanced (without weaknesses).

I see, makes sense, In your opinion lee is there a degree of to much defense? at which point would u say it takes away the sharpness of the dog? and what would be an example of to much defense in your opion???

I hate to come back with answers like, "it depends," but the truth is it does.

Can an owner/handler control an extremely sharp dog? If not, then there is certainly a possibility of too much. Each person that has a prtection dog needs to FIRST be honest with themself. What do they really need/want. You can't have a forward defense dog if you are the type of person that likes to "let their dog out to pee for example.

Also, can the dog handle the work? Some dogs will be over stressed with too much defense. A fear biter for example is an OVER STRESSED and defensive dog...and is obviously not a good dog to own. Some other dogs however can be very CONFIDENT AND even appear comfortable while working in defense if they are confident and forward. This seems odd at first, but if the dog's thresholds are high, if they have a natural prey or fight drive response, then they can be comfortable working...even if the work is defense.

It is going to come down to the dog. Understanding 1. you, 2. your needs, and 3. the dog at hand is VERY IMPORTANT to obtaining sucess.